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Hi k hanly Good points. The only thing I'd add is that the 500,000 number wasn't pulled out of a hat I don't think--it suggests the number (already a horrific understatement) of Iraqi children killed as a result of the sanctions regime. For understanding of these issues: I'd recommend Eric Herring's work; and also Geoff Simons book The Scourging of Iraq Max Le Blond ----- Original Message ----- From: "k hanly" <khanly@mb.sympatico.ca> To: "Eric Herring" <eric.herring@bristol.ac.uk>; "Salwa de Vree" <sdevree@email.com> Cc: <casi-discuss@lists.casi.org.uk> Sent: Monday, February 17, 2003 12:32 PM Subject: Re: [casi] Blair's speech -- keep the momentum going > Just a few comments on Blair's moral argument. (It ought to be called the > immoral argument.) > > 1) If the immorality of a regime is reason for going to war to overthrow it > then > a) Iraq should have been invaded long ago. > b) When Iraq was an ally it gased Kurds, used chemical weapons, and the > response was not to invade but to provide intelligence. Donald Rumsfeld was > a special envoy to Hussein who helped establish better relations with the > US. This at the time of the first use by Iraq of chemical weapons. > Surely invasion not better relations was the proper response > c) Chile under Pinochet should have been invaded. Haiti under Duvalier. > Nicaragua under Somoza...and on and on. > d) International peace would be in constant jeopardy as this or that > country decides to invade an immoral regime. > 2) Only strong regimes could enforce their moral judgments on weak regimes. > The moral argument in reality is a version of ,might makes right. The moral > argument is in fact a cover for this. > 3) The moral argument exploits peoples sense of morality to dupe them into > supporting policies that given even the most superficial analysis lack any > moral justification whatsoever. > 4) The argument ignores the immorality of war and the horrendous > consequences of war. Supposedly those who march are to have the blood of > 500,000 lives on their hands. Huh. What does he mean? That Hussein killed > 500,000. How did the marchers have anything to do with this. Of course it > sticks out as a dramatic number pulled out of a hat or some kids thesis. > And what of the blood that will be on Blair's hands as a result of deaths > caused by war and its aftermath? > > Well that is enough ranting for now. > > Cheers, Ken Hanly > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Eric Herring" <eric.herring@bristol.ac.uk> > To: "Salwa de Vree" <sdevree@email.com> > Cc: <casi-discuss@lists.casi.org.uk> > Sent: Sunday, February 16, 2003 5:00 PM > Subject: Re: [casi] Blair's speech -- keep the momentum going > > > > A quick comment to use on this. If the argument is that Saddam is such > > an intolerable beast and that is why we MUST go to war, then that means > > those taking that line must be committed to going to war even if Iraq > > complies fully with the disarmament process (and which should be > > accompanied by the lifting of the sanctions). > > > > Eric > > > > > > > > ---------------------- > > Dr. Eric Herring > > Department of Politics > > University of Bristol > > 10 Priory Road > > Bristol BS8 1TU > > England, UK > > Office tel. +44-(0)117-928-8582 > > Mobile tel. +44-(0)7771-966608 > > Fax +44-(0)117-973-2133 > > eric.herring@bristol.ac.uk > > http://www.bris.ac.uk/Depts/Politics > > http://www.ericherring.com/ > > > > Join the Network of Activist Scholars > > of Politics and International Relations (NASPIR)! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/naspir/ > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Sent via the discussion list of the Campaign Against Sanctions on Iraq. > > To unsubscribe, visit > http://lists.casi.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/casi-discuss > > To contact the list manager, email casi-discuss-admin@lists.casi.org.uk > > All postings are archived on CASI's website: http://www.casi.org.uk > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Eric Herring" <eric.herring@bristol.ac.uk> > To: "Salwa de Vree" <sdevree@email.com> > Cc: <casi-discuss@lists.casi.org.uk> > Sent: Sunday, February 16, 2003 5:00 PM > Subject: Re: [casi] Blair's speech -- keep the momentum going > > > > A quick comment to use on this. If the argument is that Saddam is such > > an intolerable beast and that is why we MUST go to war, then that means > > those taking that line must be committed to going to war even if Iraq > > complies fully with the disarmament process (and which should be > > accompanied by the lifting of the sanctions). > > > > Eric > > > > > > > > ---------------------- > > Dr. Eric Herring > > Department of Politics > > University of Bristol > > 10 Priory Road > > Bristol BS8 1TU > > England, UK > > Office tel. +44-(0)117-928-8582 > > Mobile tel. +44-(0)7771-966608 > > Fax +44-(0)117-973-2133 > > eric.herring@bristol.ac.uk > > http://www.bris.ac.uk/Depts/Politics > > http://www.ericherring.com/ > > > > Join the Network of Activist Scholars > > of Politics and International Relations (NASPIR)! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/naspir/ > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Sent via the discussion list of the Campaign Against Sanctions on Iraq. > > To unsubscribe, visit > http://lists.casi.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/casi-discuss > > To contact the list manager, email casi-discuss-admin@lists.casi.org.uk > > All postings are archived on CASI's website: http://www.casi.org.uk > > > > _______________________________________________ > Sent via the discussion list of the Campaign Against Sanctions on Iraq. > To unsubscribe, visit http://lists.casi.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/casi-discuss > To contact the list manager, email casi-discuss-admin@lists.casi.org.uk > All postings are archived on CASI's website: http://www.casi.org.uk _______________________________________________ Sent via the discussion list of the Campaign Against Sanctions on Iraq. To unsubscribe, visit http://lists.casi.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/casi-discuss To contact the list manager, email casi-discuss-admin@lists.casi.org.uk All postings are archived on CASI's website: http://www.casi.org.uk